me for Prez 2012

Let the debates begin.

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me for Prez 2012

Postby Direblade » February 7th, 2008, 9:17 am

I am tossing my motheaten hat out there for opinions. My positions are as follows.........

1) More money for military spending

2) Better pay for soldiers

3) More training for soldiers

4) Exile Hillary

5) Exile Bill

6) Strict enforcement of 1st and 2nd amendment rights

7) Pay cuts for President and Congress

8) More education spending, national educational standardization focussing on individual skills and technical education

9) More spending on Law enforcement.

10) Legalize Marijuana and tax the fuck out of it, use those funds to help with education and law enforcement costs.

11) Child Molestation should be a death penalty offense nationwide

12) Flat Income Tax, no deductions, no shelters, everyone pays their part

13) Fuck the rich

14) Welfare reform - no more free rides, welfare consists of paid housing and food delivery while attending technical training and seeking work, once employed you cant file again for 2 years unless the industry bottoms out. If you have kids it will pay daycare at a APPROVED center.

15) Border security - machine guns, electrified fences, rabid dogs, and landmines, enough said.

16) Immigration - for citizenship require legal aliens to learn to speak and read English to atleast a 4th grade level within 5 years of assuming residence. Sole exception being elderly people who are political refugees or Learning disabled refugees.

17) Family values, if your kids are fucked up, its likely your fault, psychobabble is only so effective, after that is spanking time.

18) Land grants for Native Americans in DECENT areas

19) Fuck the rich

20) Exile Hillary

21) Exile Bill

22) Toughened penalties for violent crime

23) We need a REASONABLE definition of what is abuse, a parent spanking their child isnt it, a parent HITTING their child is.

24) Make voting a right earned through service to the community/nation as either a police officer, Soldier, trashman whatever but make people earn it. Then MAYBE it wont be taken for granted.

25) Tax the ratfuck out of imports

26) FUCK NAFTA

27) Tax companies that outsource jobs outside the US.

28) One world government? I dont fucking think so!

29) Fuck the UN

30) Legalize prostitution tax the fuck out of it, require health permits

31) Fuck the UN

32) Exile Bill

33) Exile Hillary

34) Terrorist = Automatic death penalty if found guilty, executed within 30 days unless under appeal

35) Middle Eastern Policy - Play nice or get nuked, dont like it? Fuck you (pushes the button). (Only exception Israel, those fuckers are nuts in a GOOD way)

36) North Korean/China Policy - Play nice or get Nuked, You may have them, we have more, Dont like it? Fuck you too! (places ballistic missile sub fleet off china coast in shallow water and pushes THAT button)

37) Russian Policy - You wanna go back to being communist? Cool, pay us the fucking money you owe us first bitches. Dont like it? (do we see the trend yet?)

38) Dont like this country? Do something to help make it better or get the fuck out.

39) Fuck the UN

40) Exile Bill

41) Exile Hillary

42) Have a nice day

43) Free Sex day Feb 13th of each year all prostitutes are required to service all custmers for free, minimum of three customers per on this day. It will be a National Holiday for all other buisnesses.

44) Term limits for congressmen and senators

45) Make Murder a federal offense, if convicted of Murder 1 automatic Death Penalty, executed in 30 days unless under appeal

46) Make Rape a federal Offense, if convicted Automatic 5 year sentence at HARD LABOR plus forced castration, castration within 30 days unless under appeal.

47) Require a permit for procreation - to obtain permit one must show financial responsibility and pass an IQ test

48) Social Security - if you didnt pay in (ie illegal immigrants) you arent getting one god damn cent out, dont like it??? Fuck you, we got rope for that.

49) Executions - Executions should be public and gruesome (hanging) so as to discourage others from the same crime.

50) Fuck the Geneva convention no one else obeys it why should we?

51) Fuck Amnesty International

52) General criminal offenses - all prison terms should be at hard labor, unless it is medically infeasable for the particular inmate. Rather than letting inmates leach off society for years watching free cable, eating, etc and doing nothing make the fuckers EARN that shit. If an inmate wants to do school as well fine, let them do it based on an amended work schedule (no less than 25 hours a week if in classes, if not in school no less than 45 hours a week at labor).

53) Pheonix Az has a tent city for a jail, I like that idea, and the Mojave desert could make an excellent Tent Federal Prison for those special fucknuts that need extra attention.

54) Medical care - all LEGAL CITIZENS are guaranteed free medical insurance through the government. Note this DOES NOT apply to resident aliens legal or otherwise.

Specific discussions -

Military policy
First off the military is understaffed, thus I would like to see an increase in troop stength of 20% along with a 15% pay raise to all grades enlisted and commissioned both. The M-16, along with a number of other light arms are past due for replacement, and this should be addressed as well. Non mission critical support services such as clergy would NOT be increased under my plan, only combat forces and mission critical support. Additionally I would like to see BCT (Boot camp) extended an extra 7 weeks across all branches with much of the additional time spent on infantry skills training and more advanced first aid. Each branch should require all members to additionally attend a urban combat survival training prior to technical training for their specialty. In my opinion this should be another 6 weeks of intense training focussing on surviving in a hostile urban environment in the case of support troops/pilots/etc, in the case of combat troops, especially infantry it should focus on clearing a hostile urban environment. Additionally Military Intelligence should be increased in terms of staffing and equipment should be upgraded in order to aid their mission.

Law Enforcement
Law enforcement should also be recieving raises, as well as more manpower and technological support. Fewer restrictions should be placed on officers at all levels in use of force/deadly force in order to apprehend suspects, especially in violent crime scenerios. Additionally, lets be honest the role of prsons is NOT rehabilitation that seldom works, a prisons role is punishment. Punishment SHOULD be unusual in that it should not be so widely required as it is today, and it should be firm in its intent to be severe enough to strongly discourage or disallow altogether repeat offenses. Thus all inmates should be set on work schedules, health permitting, doing something to pa society back for their crimes. Ideally these jobs should be unpleasant in the extreme (breaking rocks, digging ditches in te desert, Handling HAZMAT waste, etc) so as to drive home that they fucked up. Additionally this approach just might actually convince atleast a few more to actually try and change their lives, since at this point prison would no longer be a summer camp for criminal skills.

Foreign policy
Guess what, it isnt our job to play global sheriff, however since the rest of the world keeps asking us to (and then bitching about how we do it) lets get the fucking point across. We are THE badasses on the block, we ARE NOT going to be fucked with anymore, and WE ARE THE ONE NATION THAT HAS EVER USED A NUKE IN ANGER.

Domestic Policy
My domestic policies would be built around the principals this country was founded on of fairness, free enterprise, and individual responsibility as well as individual rights.
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Postby Wenceslas » February 7th, 2008, 3:43 pm

13) Fuck the rich


Ya had my vote until you came up with that socialist statement...

The rich, for the most part excluding the shitballs like Kennedy, fuckin earned their billions...let'em keep it and spend it however they want. It's the fuckin RICH that make and break jobs in all kinds of corporations.

Let'em pay the same tax I do.

I think it's fuckin bullshit that the top 1% pay > 50% of the fed taxes.
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Postby Drawnir » February 7th, 2008, 4:18 pm

Well since he's running for Prez, it's only natural that he be allowed to warp and change his mission statement as many times as is needed to make everyone happy.

As long as you can pretend you never saw it, all will be fine =)
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Postby Direblade » February 7th, 2008, 10:06 pm

Fuck the rich is hardly a socialist statement. The fact is that you're wrong MOST of the rich in this country were born into wealth, their ancestors may have "earned" it, but they temselves have not. Furter more often than not they have gotten rich, or ricer as the case may be, by screwing over the average citizen (witness the gas companies who when their cost rises 20 cents raise their price 50 cents). If they gave a fat damn about the coutry I might not feel that way, but lets face it, they send jobs outside of tis country, lowering their costs, but then turn around and raise prices. They without exception shelter the vast majority of their money to avoid paying a fair share of taxes, and few of them actually do much to try and give back to their country or communities.

Nowhere in there did I say take all their money and give it to everyone. I said make them pay a fair share on income tax, and tax them when they outsource jobs to other countries. Neither of these ideas are socialist in nature, and definately, atleast from the point of view of the rich it will qualif as fucking them. I'd also like to see some protections put in place on small buisness startups, because many large companies abuse their financial resources to keep competition down when it suits their purposes , an act which HURTS small buisness as well as the economy as a whole, and free enterprise. Obviously in sme cases economies of scale would make this impractical (ie the electric company) but I have watched time and time again chain stores drop their costs below where local retailers can compete, sometimes even to the point of taking a loss themselves temporarily, just to drive a local retailer out of the market so that they can have what, on a local level atleast, is a monopoly.

Simply put, my plan calls for making them pay their share of taxes, making them help eat some of the cost of retraining when they outsource jobs to other countries leaving people here homeless, and atleast to some extent, leel the playing field of small buisness verses mega corporations. Thats not socialism, thats called encouraging small buisness growth and making large busnesses help pay for it when they fuck communities over for the sake of profit.
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Postby Khaw » February 7th, 2008, 10:37 pm

Direblade wrote:I said make them pay a fair share on income tax


You can't have a flat tax rate and then tax one groups income more.
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Postby Direblade » February 7th, 2008, 10:53 pm

Taxing them on income is a flat tax, the other tax I mentioned is not based on income it is based on them moving jobs outside the US. Saying one cant do both is like saying you cant have a flat tax rate them the state have a sales tax. They are separate issues.
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Postby Khaw » February 7th, 2008, 11:03 pm

Direblade wrote:Taxing them on income is a flat tax,


You said make them pay a fair share. If the top 1% income earners already pay 50% of the income tax, how does making a flat tax rate do that? Are you pruposing that all low income families pay taxes at the same percentage on income that the top 1% is paying now? If not you are in no way shape or form making them pay there fair share as you make it sound, if anything you will be reducing the tax burden they carry. If you are then you are in fact screwing the lower income families who will now have there income drastically reduced as the tax rate increases, the exact opposite of what you make it sound.

Think of it this way, you tax the top 1% at 15% now and lower income at 5%. Now you go to a flat 10% across the board, the rich get richer and poor get poorer. Or you move everyone up to 15% and the poor get even poorer.

I'm not saying I agree with the way taxes are, but what your saying isn't a flat rate, if you want to make the rich pay there fair share, that they are already paying. That is unless your going to stick it to the little guy you make it sound like you want to help.

Taxing corp's for outsourcing jobs, I'm fine with.
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Postby Direblade » February 7th, 2008, 11:38 pm

BS Khaw the top 1% of income make (nearly) 50% of the money and pay less than 2% of the taxes, even when you figure in luxury and inheritance taxes. In terms of income tax they pay less than any other group in terms of percentage of income.

And yes everyone should pay the same percentage on income tax, I see no reason that Joe Schmuck should pay 10% on 25,000 a year while Joe Kennedy Rockefucker pays .5% on 25 million a year.

Dont believe me? My uncles income is 50 times greater on the average year than mine of the best year I've ever had, and he usually pays less than half what I did that year(my best year) in tax dollars because of shelters and deductions. we're not talking percentage, we're not talking percentages, we're talking hard dollars. And every single shelter/deduction he uses is completely legal and totally inaccessable to anyone who doesn't make a lot more than just living on money (ie 10 grand a year in DISPOSABLE income).
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Postby Wenceslas » February 7th, 2008, 11:54 pm

BS Khaw the top 1% of income make (nearly) 50% of the money and pay less than 2% of the taxes


I would like to see your "facts.
This is, actually, bullshit.
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Postby Xanai » February 8th, 2008, 12:12 am

Well, since you've opened this up for debate...

I'll address only the points I have a problem with, for some of the ones I don't address I'm 100% in agreement

1) More money for military spending

The military does not need more money, the military needs less. Very conservative estimates would put the DoD budget at 21% of our total government spending while liberal estimates would put the budget at something like 51% of the budget (when you factor in things like SS income shouldn't be in the general fund to begin with).

More importantly, how are you going to Constitutionally support the increase of a military that the Constitution doesn't give you the right to have in the first place. Don't you have to take an oath to defend the US Constitution from all enemies foreign and domestic?

Strict enforcement of 1st and 2nd amendment rights

I'd like a Bazooka and some nerve gas please, since they're both defined as "arms."

Pay cuts for President and Congress

For the Supreme office of Executor the President makes crap money, something like $235,000. Considering he could wipe out all life on earth with the push of a button, I'd want to increase such a persons pay.

More education spending, national educational standardization focussing on individual skills and technical education

The US spends more money on education than every other modern country and what has it gotten us? No much that's for sure. As in anything if you create a monopoly (such as the "Public school system") you'll get a crappy product.

Flat Income Tax, no deductions, no shelters, everyone pays their part

Fuck the rich

As others have pointed out, these two assertions are mutually exclusive. More importantly, why do you want to penalize the producers? Sorry to sound like Ragnar Danneskjold but the strong and vital producers should not be penalize, instead penalize the weak and inneffectual consumers.

Welfare reform - no more free rides, welfare consists of paid housing and food delivery while attending technical training and seeking work, once employed you cant file again for 2 years unless the industry bottoms out. If you have kids it will pay daycare at a APPROVED center.

Where does the Constitution give you the right to take my money and give it to another person who isn't working for the government?

Land grants for Native Americans in DECENT areas

Why? Will the native americans give pieces of their land grants to the people that they conquered before we got here? Will those people then give pieces of their land grant to the people that they conquered before they got there?

Make voting a right earned through service to the community/nation as either a police officer, Soldier, trashman whatever but make people earn it. Then MAYBE it wont be taken for granted.

Why not just go back to when only people who owned land could vote?

Tax the ratfuck out of imports

Good idea, then the poor people who can only afford the cheap goods from outside our country (like the people who shop at Wal-mart) can either starve or live in abject poverty. Brilliant!

Tax companies that outsource jobs outside the US.

This makes no sense. If I own company X, I can pay worker Y $20 (good money for where he lives) an hour to make 10 shoes, or I can move to country Z pay a guy $1 (good money for where he lives) an hour and he'll make 15 shoes and won't take breaks. It costs be $10 to ship the shoe across the globe now, instead of the standard rate of $3 but now the shoe only cost $11 instead of $23. In a competitive marketplace I can now undercut my competitors and sell a shoe for $14 instead of $29 (same markup on both). This also means that the poor can afford to buy my shoes instead of having to wear newspapers on their feet (or whatever). This same analogy works for the "Tax the F out of imports" - taxing the imports creates problems for everyone.

On the flip side, guy Y in country Z now is making serious bank in comparison to his neighbors. What does he do with all his newfound wealth? He probably buys a pair of my cheap shoes, so he can flaunt his wealth. He makes money, my company makes money, the consumers save money and the whole world moves one step out of the economic crapper that produces those bearded, towel-heads who want to blow up buildings.

Terrorist = Automatic death penalty if found guilty, executed within 30 days unless under appeal

Define "terrorist" please.

Make Murder a federal offense, if convicted of Murder 1 automatic Death Penalty, executed in 30 days unless under appeal

Make Rape a federal Offense, if convicted Automatic 5 year sentence at HARD LABOR plus forced castration, castration within 30 days unless under appeal.

What in the Constitution gives you the authority to do this? This same question could be asked for a lot of your positions, however I'm assuming you're being sarcastic some of the time.

Require a permit for procreation - to obtain permit one must show financial responsibility and pass an IQ test

Do we really need to bring up the Beethoven example here? Surely everyone's seen it by now...

Additionally, lets be honest the role of prsons is NOT rehabilitation that seldom works, a prisons role is punishment.

80% of the people in prison WILL be getting out, the question you have to ask yourself is: Do I want a healthy and functioning adult getting out of prison or do I want a hardened criminal with years of punishment heaped on years of punishment living in my neighborhood? Either way, you're getting one of them.

Guess what, it isnt our job to play global sheriff, however since the rest of the world keeps asking us to (and then bitching about how we do it) lets get the fucking point across.

Except that you want our military in every country on the planet so we can tell the whole world how to run their country. Yes, I see how this ties into your general principles on fairness and individual rights...

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Postby Direblade » February 8th, 2008, 2:09 am

My short response

Wence as usual you know two thing, Jack, and shit. Look at the 2000 and later information the rich can shelter 95% or more of their income in tax free ventures that WILL produce profits if they work it right, and can get amazing deductions on whats left all of it legal.

Xanai, complaining about a larger Military when its been cut by a huge percentage in the last 20 years, and when it has existed in its present form, and more often far larger than at present, for over 100 years is whining immaturity at its best. Nowhere did I say I want troops all over the world, but every time we dont go all we hear is bitching (the same thing we hear when we DO go) therefore we may as well get shit taken care of. As for your other arguments I'll debunk them as soon as I finish this group.

In terms of constitutionality - this government hasnt done shit about the constitution in 147 years roughly, why should it start now?
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Postby Xanai » February 8th, 2008, 2:28 am

Xanai, complaining about a larger Military when its been cut by a huge percentage in the last 20 years,

Evidence please or I'm also going to just start making stuff up. If you assert it then it's up to you to prove that you're right.

and when it has existed in its present form, and more often far larger than at present, for over 100 years is whining immaturity at its best.

Let's see that's:
1) Factually incorrect & 2) an Ad hominem attack, which has nothing to do with anything.

Nowhere did I say I want troops all over the world, but every time we dont go all we hear is bitching (the same thing we hear when we DO go) therefore we may as well get shit taken care of.

*Ahem* let me put it to you this way:

WE HAVE TROOPS ALL OVER THE WORLD.

If #1 on your list o' things to do is make the military bigger then we're going to have troops all over the world and more of them. Great, just what we need. Especially if you "don't want to be the world's policeman"

As for your other arguments I'll debunk them as soon as I finish this group.

Go for it.

In terms of constitutionality - this government hasnt done shit about the constitution in 147 years roughly, why should it start now?

Because. It's. Legal.

If the Constitution isn't upheld then all bets are off. Term limits for Congressmen? Enforceable by whom? All I have to do is find a judge to determine the meaning of "term" or "limit" or "Congress" or "a" or any other term I don't like. Same for the President.

Free speech? Right to own guns? Right to practice your religion? What is the meaning of "people", "militia", "speech", "religion" , "free exercise" etc? Basically you'll be running for "President" when what you really mean is "Emperor;" because your decisions will only carry weight as long as you're in office and as soon as the new Emperor is chosen he can override everything you've done - because there's not really any objective law.

If you're really running for President, then #1 on your list should be to start arresting people for mucking with the Constitution - including Congressmen, Supreme Court Justices, etc. AFTER, you've fulfilled your oath of office, to defend the Constitution, then you can try to implement every hair-brained scheme you can come up with... legally.

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Postby Wenceslas » February 8th, 2008, 3:52 am

Wence as usual you know two thing, Jack, and shit. Look at the 2000 and later information the rich can shelter 95%


Good solid facts, excellent rebuttal.
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Postby Jorelora » February 8th, 2008, 4:03 am

OMG, Direblade has actually managed to create a post that has me 100% in agreement with Xanai.....I'm scared!
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Postby Direblade » February 8th, 2008, 4:18 am

Allow me to clarify Xanai the constitution hasnt been followed unless it was convient in a century and a half. Began in 1860 and hasn't stopped since. Want examples? The Brady Bill, The Vietnam War, Lend Lease just before WW2, te federalization of state troops in the 1860's, shall I continue?

Never stated we didnt have troops all over the world, I stated I dont want them all over the world, however since we seem to be forced into this over and over fuck it we should have enough to do the fucking job.

Secondly Xanai if you'll recall during the mid 80's to early 90's the Military cutback a number of bases, scaled back the number of units on active duty, etc, The Clinton administration further cut back numbers of active duty troops and bases (ie the conversion of Carswell AFB from a active bomber base to a JRB under Naval Control). As for the military not needing payraises? I DARE you to go on any base and tell the soldiers, who in the main make a FUCKOFALOT less than a civilian in the same job that, I can guarantee all the MMA in the world wouldnt stop the asskicking that would ensue. Simply put, ESPECIALLY technical MOS's dont get paid nearly what their civilian counterparts do. Example my brother was a Sgt. (E4) in the AF when he left he was an AMP on KC 135, upon leaving he had to pay for school to get certified as a AMP in the civilian world (note the exact same job) but once finished began being paid 38,000 a year to start - MUCH more than he made as a Sgt in the AF. Computer network technicials in MY area have a average pay WITH NO DEGREE of 55-65k a year after 5 years thats JUST based off being CCNA/MCSE certified, yet a computer tech at E5 or even E6 on active military duty makes roughly half that, and it generally takes more than 5 years to make e6, plus they still have to pay for their own civilian certs when they leave in many cases.

Theres the evidence for my stand on the military. Look up the numbers (I recommend an assessment of the threat 1988 which detailed our troop numbers versus soviet at the time and compare it to current), it will clearly demonstrate that the military, in terms of active duty, has in fact shrunk. Want another example a number of units were also disbanded during the last 20 years.

As far as calling my goals Imperial. Your argument there makes ZERO sense as each time the White House changes hands in terms of party the first thing the new president does typically is reverse all the policies of the previous administration. Further lets face it, no less than ancient Rome we are an Empire. Like it or no it is fact. Further we are an Empire which was founded on conquest (of Native American nations, through victories in te Mexican American War, the Spanish American War, WW1 and 2 etc.) What is Puerto Rico, the entire South West, most of the Midwest, etc if not conquered territory?

As for the money the President makes, yes it is crappy for the job, but the perks (Air Force 1, taxpayer paid 500 dollar haircuts on the runway, etc) more than make up for it.

Education spending is being mostly misspent which is why I say it should not only increase, but reform the systems of education to produce technically proficient students who have needed job skills. Rather than griping on one point take in the whole argument.

As for calling the rich the producers? I could debate that point all day long since te DEFINITION of production in to make something, and the rich themselves dont do that, their employees do.

You want a bazooka and nerve gas? Consttutionally you have that right. Constitutionally if you fuck up and get caught you would be tried, and if convicted punished.

On welfare reform you ask about my right to take your money and give t to others, Xanai, thats already being done, what the fuckdo you think welfare is. Atleast reformed it would force them to get the fuck off welfare after training them in something valuable to society rather than them staying on welfares rolls potentially for years at a time.

Your questioning of Land grants is probably I grant the hardest point to argue, the point though is the reservations they were given in treaties were land that no one else wanted. to give them atleast some land worth living on is little more than MINOR redress for such atrocities as the trail of tears.

As for my stance on viting rights? Xanai answer me this should some little gang member who has raped 6 women, sold drugs to 300 kids under the age of 15, etc have the same say in how the country is run as someone who instead risked their life to save a child they didnt knowfrom a burning building? I dont fucking think so. I dont consider it that problematic tat someone should be asked to EARN te right to vote, so long as everyone has the opportunity to earn that right.

As for taxing imports, guess what, if jobs here weren't constantly being outsourced to fucking india, and the schools were turning kids out with a DESIREABLE education then there wouldnt be as many poor, and even the poor still left would likely still be better off than they are now. Further taxing imports would keep our products competitive with imports atleast here in the US.

Terrorst - anyone using force/deadly against CIVILIAN targets with the intent to induce such fear as to influence national policy

If by the Beethoven example you refer to the fact he was deaf long before composing many of his greatest works, yes he was deaf, but his intelligence can hardly be questioned now can it? Considering how many people are currently on welfare because they cant (or wont) get jobs at all or cant or wont get jobs that pay enough to support their families, personally I'm sick of paying for someone else to sit on their ass and have kids while I go to school, work, and take care of my own responsibilities and can barely scrape together the 20 bucks a month for EQ after that sometimes.

Yes 80% of people in prison do get out, and while they are in many under the current system end up joining prison gangs, learning to be better criminals, etc. Those who use it as a chance to reform themselves are few and far between. Witness how many repeat offenders there are under the current system. Atleast with less resort like prisons they would have incentive to stay the fuck out once they are released, and would be helping defray the costs of imprisoning them. Further may I note that in the das of old school chain gangs and hard labor we had no NEED for three time loser laws, which are necessary now. Get the feeling tat MAYBE just maybe there was something about harsh conditions that encouraged people to stay the fuck outta trouble after release?

Now Wence have you ever seen the income curve in this country and then looked up the tax rates, ALL the potential shelters and deductions, etc and then figured out exactly how much money you have to make to effectively make use of every possible shelter/deduction? I know from personal experience that my uncle's tax preparer finds a lot more deductions and shelters than H&R Blockheads can find for me. I know beyond any shadow that while my uncle in 1998 cleared over 500 grand and I made only 28.5 that year, somehow his taxable income was lower than mine..... I also know he was audited that year and still had lower taxable income than me even with the audit.


Now all this said - do I perhaps exaggerate to make points on occasion? Yes, but the points I make are valid nonetheless.

Jorelora wrote:OMG, Direblade has actually managed to create a post that has me 100% in agreement with Xanai.....I'm scared!


Jore, when/if I should ever not scare you, it will disturb me greatly.

Xanai - I was out of line with the immaturity comment, however if you look up the facs you will find that the active duty military has shrunk over the years, and that is has had serious issues in recent years with personell retention because of te pay discrepancy etween military and civilian especially in technical fields.
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Postby Pressto » February 8th, 2008, 4:54 am

Sorry, but you lost my vote with all the money you want to spend when we already have a 9 Trillion debt. Nothing in there talked about reducing spending and in fact I think I see more spending in your plan then everyone running for President now combined and you would run the country into the ground.
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Postby Direblade » February 8th, 2008, 5:01 am

Yes my plan would call for more spending in the short term.

HOWEVER I would be planning cuts in foreign aid except to key allies, plus in the long term I believe we would see imprisonment costs go down, as well as Welfare costs, plus with more educated members of the workforce unemployment would be lower, and therefore there would be a larger active tax base.

In the LONG run I believe it worth the cost. Just as in buisness you cant reap positive gains without putting money and work in to uild te structures to create them. Short term loss vs Long term gain is at best a deliate balancing act.
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Postby Pressto » February 8th, 2008, 6:11 am

Direblade wrote:Yes my plan would call for more spending in the short term.

HOWEVER I would be planning cuts in foreign aid except to key allies, plus in the long term I believe we would see imprisonment costs go down, as well as Welfare costs, plus with more educated members of the workforce unemployment would be lower, and therefore there would be a larger active tax base.

In the LONG run I believe it worth the cost. Just as in buisness you cant reap positive gains without putting money and work in to uild te structures to create them. Short term loss vs Long term gain is at best a deliate balancing act.

Let me say this again because I believe this is one of the biggest problems our country has that is blown over by the Media and Candidate.

9 Trillion debt

You plan would double it and as I said bankrupt the country. It is sad how many politicians spend money faster then a Sugar Baby with a credit card in a shoe store. That is nice when you have extra money, but not when you are already in debt over your head.
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Postby Wenceslas » February 8th, 2008, 7:39 am

As a percentage of GDP this is about 6%.
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Postby Direblade » February 8th, 2008, 8:01 am

Yes we owe 9 Trillion dollars. Guess what, this doesnt really account for what other coutries owe us in terms of loans we have given them for financial stimulus, etc. When you figure in those amounts we are in point of fact not in the red that far. The national debt is calculated based on import/export and spending versus prduction. Cutting the amount of financial aid we are giving out and calling in some of the money we are owed would take a LOT of the sting out of the increased spending. Not all of it, no, but most.

Wence must have finally learned to google things since he mentioned the GDP, congrats on that one Wence.

Further, one other thing. It is HIGHLY unlikely that any amount of Debt would bankrupt this country. Simply put foreign investors and US investments overseas create too much of a mutual self interest. It would benefit no one to allow us to become bankrupt, as the US becomming bankrupt would throw the global economy into chaos,therefore it wouldnt happen.
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Postby Wenceslas » February 8th, 2008, 8:38 am

Some of us, Dire, don't have to google to remember what the fuck GDP is to begin with.
Some of us, Dire, read GAO and other economic reports as a matter of course just to take a peek at where the money's going besides the leftists ratholes. That leftists rathole crap includes the republican leftist ratholes which totally explains why the republicans did not put our own back into office in 2006. We figured that if we wanted big government - we might as well let the REAL leftists run the country into the ground.

And they're doing fine in that regard.

I'd vote for you, Dire, for President right behind Jimmy Carter, Pat Buchanon, Ralph Nader, Bill Clinton's 3rd bid, Roger Clinton's 1st bid or anyone from the Great City of Berkeley CA who are busy trying to rid themselves of those wascally pests - the Marine Corp. Be thankful that I'd vote you in, Dire, before I'd see the Bitch of the East Hillary in the White House.
But then, I'd write in my fucking dogs before I would vote for the Bitch of the East.

But again - this is a snarky post to begin with.
No one should be taking this shit personally.

Except for the Bitch of the East...that IS personal.
Hell - it's survival.

(patiently waiting for the house to drop on the Bitch of the East)
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Postby Direblade » February 8th, 2008, 8:42 am

No worries Wence I would vote for you just before Bill or HIllary too, though I might vote Carter ahead of you...........

Simply put Wence, I dont Have to read economic magazines daily, two reasons, 1) I'm a networking student not an economist, 2) I had to take economics last semester(Including a final that was so overdone it was pathetic) so I'm frankly sick of economics for now anyway.
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Postby Pressto » February 8th, 2008, 8:46 am

The national debt is calculated based on import/export and spending versus prduction.

What you are talking about is trade deficits there so I suggest you go take a econ 101 class because the debt is based on our outstanding bonds and the interest we pay on it.

You actually sound like a politician now, because it seems most don't have a clue about our deficit or are willing to address the problems we are running into with it.

Let me put this in prespective that you might understand with a nice chart.

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Yes that is right, last year alone we had to pay $430 BILLION in interest payments.

Here is the official gov website that list what we have paid each year in interest.

http://www.treasurydirect.gov/govt/repo ... xpense.htm

I was leaning towards voting for Romney this year because I thought he was the only candidate that could understand the mess we are in and would do something about it due to his business background.
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Postby Direblade » February 8th, 2008, 8:54 am

Pressto you might want to take REMEDIAL reading and/or look before doing someting stupid, I just stated I TOOK econ last semester, paid just enough attention to get it over with, guess what, econ has Jack and Shit to do with computer networking. Your Pretty graph gives me a headache just looking at it, especially since I cant see color anyway.
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Postby Pressto » February 8th, 2008, 9:08 am

Direblade wrote:Pressto you might want to take REMEDIAL reading and/or look before doing someting stupid, I just stated I TOOK econ last semester, paid just enough attention to get it over with, guess what, econ has Jack and Shit to do with computer networking. Your Pretty graph gives me a headache just looking at it, especially since I cant see color anyway.

Then how could you state: "The national debt is calculated based on import/export and spending versus prduction." No wonder our schools are so terrible now.

If they didn't teach you the difference between a trade deficit and national debt I suggest you go back to the school and get a refund for the econ class. :)
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